Messages

1486

Dermarolling / Microneedling / Acne scars and hyperpigments.....help!!

« on: July 01, 2011, 04:34:43 PM »

Actually, since you do not seem to have too many scars and they are localized, you should use a 1.5 mm dermastamp and the single needles (use the single needles on ice pick scars.).

   

  Stamp the same scar 6-8 times in one go with the dermastamp. If it heals OK you can stamp slightly more the next time. You have to experiment a little.

   

  You can stamp or needle whenever you have time but do not stamp or needle the same scar more than once every four weeks.

   The area around the mouth is from my experience the most sensitive and you might need a numbing cream there. You can buy it later, after you tried it without one.

   Whenever I receive a question about scars on the nose, I get nervous.. The problem is, that the skin on the nose reacts very unpredictably comparing to the rest of the skin. Nasal skin can heal worse than you started with. There is no fat layer under that skin, there is only cartilage and that might be the reason.

   I can only suggest this: Use the single needle on it but do not do any aggressive needling. Concerning the nose, ignore the guidelines for needling that are on our website. Make just three pricks into your scar (to the bottom of the scar not to the edges).

   

  If it heals well, make four pricks the next time. If it heals well, make five pricks the next time. Continue like this but never do aggressive, dense needling. Just a few, very gentle pricks.

1487

Dermarolling / Microneedling / Barbicide to sterilize dermarollers?

« on: July 01, 2011, 03:50:26 PM »

Barbicide contains Alkyl dimethyl benzyl ammonium chloride, which is an alcohol-free disinfectant. Alcohol based disinfectants are very effective but you can use this one too.

  Regarding the dermarolling after care cream, just use any cream that you know doesn't make you brake out but it should be a bit heavier cream that really keeps the skin moisturized long-term.

1488

Dermarolling / Microneedling / Help with atrophic scars.

« on: June 30, 2011, 05:16:40 PM »

I have no idea who you are so I can't say anything about your order. If you haven't received a shipping confirmation yet (usually within 24 hours of ordering), then we could combine orders.

The single needles are 1.5 to 2 mm long and they stop by themselves as a safety feature.

1489

Dermarolling / Microneedling / Help with atrophic scars.

« on: June 30, 2011, 03:27:13 PM »

You should definitely buy the single needles for intensive scar treatment.

  The scar in the crease is really difficult to roll intensively with a roller.

   

  Needle the scar with the single needles very thoroughly and densely every four weeks until you achieve results.

   First, roll the area with the 1.5 mm roller, then immediately afterwards or when you have time, needle them.

   

  You can use the 0.5 mm dermaroller too but wait until the needling has healed.

   

  It is difficult to use a roller under breast crease. You should lift your breast with one hand and roll only up and down (direction back and forth towards the nipple). When you go back and forth, lift the roller before each movement to avoid the needles going back into the same pricks.

   Surgery scars - apply Infadolan immediately after dermarolling and about ten days afterwards to keep the needled scar occluded. Just a little Infadolan is enough.

   

  Mondor's Cords are inflamed veins and you should not roll over them if they are not healed.

   

  The instructions for the one liner mean to say that you can roll every day but every day a different scar. Many customers have dozens of stretch marks and they cannot roll them all properly with the one liner in one go. They roll several stretch marks per day but every day different ones. You have

  only two scars so that is easy.

1490

Dermarolling / Microneedling / Acne scars and hyperpigments.....help!!

« on: June 30, 2011, 02:37:42 PM »

I am confused. The acne scars appeared after the IPL treatment or you have had them already and only your hyperpigmentation worsened after the IPL?

   

  The A-Ret gel we sell helps diminishing hyperpigmentaion -it speeds up the skin's turnover. However if the hyperpigmentation is caused by the IPL, it may be in the dermis part of the skin (the deep part of the skin) and that is difficult to get rid off and takes a long time. Did you get burns after the IPL?  Normally, the IPL should reduce existing hyperpigmentaion.

   

  If you have just a couple of scars, the best is to use the single needles and prick the individual scars. Each scar should be needled once a month until you achieve results.

   

  If you have many scars, use the combination of a 1.5 mm dermaroller and the single needles.

   Regarding the products, read answer #8:

   

  https://http://forums.owndoc.com/dermarolling-microneedling/Best-Skin-Care-RoutineD/a>

(You do not have to use the copper peptides and Infadolan.)

Vit. C will also help the hyperpigmentaion but only after prolonged use.

1491

Dermarolling / Microneedling / Subcision frequency

« on: June 30, 2011, 02:11:53 PM »

Saline injections are not suitable for your type of scars.

     

  The most efficient way to treat surgical scars is single needling. We sell custom-made single needles.

   Please read Chapter 8 in our instructions with info on how to do it:

  https://http://dermaroller.owndoc.com/dermar...structions.pdf

   

Needling can't, - neither can any current method, even the most expensive - make the scar totally disappear. The damage occurs throughout all skin layers.   Needling can soften the scar and change its appearance to be more naturally skin-tone.

 

If you scar is raised, perform pressure massage. Every day you'll apply pressure with your fingers onto the scar for approx. 20 seconds, spot by spot. Do this pressure massage also immediately after needling.

1492

Dermarolling / Microneedling / single needling, dermarolling, frequency, etc

« on: June 30, 2011, 02:02:35 PM »

I was not completely sure that by "dermastamp those three and then roll over my whole face again" you mean rolling immediately afterwards so I wrote about scabs just in case that you might want to roll later.

1493

Dermarolling / Microneedling / can I single needle if Im pregnant?

« on: June 30, 2011, 01:19:25 PM »

Yes you can needle when pregnant but just to be on the safe side, don't needle extensive areas in one session. The needles are sterilely packaged.

   

  Also do not needle if it causes too much pain or stress for you. Mothers-to-be should not be stressed.

   

  Yes you will get results even without using vit. A topicals.

Vit. A overdosing concerns its oral intake but producers of topical creams with vit. A want to avoid any potential liability and misunderstandings. It is much easier for them to state not to use vit. A creams during pregnancy than risking a court case or lots of questions regarding its use when pregnant.

1494

Dermarolling / Microneedling / Results in 6 months :)

« on: June 28, 2011, 05:44:20 PM »

Yes, wipe the Betadine off with tap water before you roll but leave it for about three minutes on your skin to get the effect. It will not penetrate the skin, don't worry.

   

To disinfect a dermaroller, use about 70% ethanol (ethyl alcohol) or a mixture of ethanol and up to 45% isopropyl alcohol (we have a customer who soaked her dermaroller in 80% isopropyl and her dermaroller partially fell apart).  I soaked mine for several days in ethanol with 30% isopropyl and it was fine.

     

Some tips on where to buy:
   

https://http://forums.owndoc.com/dermarolling-microneedling/can39t-find-proper-disinfection-alcohol/


   

90% ethanol is not so suitable for skin disinfection because it evaporates too quickly off the skin so it doesn't have time enough to effectively disinfect. 

Also, alcohols are most effective for disinfection when combined with water to facilitate diffusion through the cell membrane - 100% alcohol typically denatures only external membrane proteins. This applies both to disinfecting the skin and the dermaroller.

   

If you buy ethanol that is much stronger than 70%, just dilute it with tap water to around 70-80%.

Denatured alcohol is ethanol that has additives to make it unsuitable for drinking. One of the common additives to make ethanol undrinkable is adding methanol - methylated spirits.  Nevertheless not all denatured alcohols are suitable for skin disinfection or even for dermaroller disinfection.

   

I paste here a reply from an expert:

   Question:

 

   

  --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

   

  what is the difference between denatured alcohol and rubbing alcohol?

   

   

  --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

   

  Reply:

   

   

  --------------------------------------------------------------------------------

   

  Denatured alcohol is ethanol to which poisonous and foul-tasting chamicals

  have been added to make it unfit for drinking. There is more than one recipe

  for denaturing alcohol; some add methanol or isopropanol, some gasoline, and

  so on.

   

  Rubbing alcohol is an alcohol intended to be rubbed on the skin. Frequently

  70% iso-propyl alcohol / 30% water is used; sometimes ethanol with added

  iso-propyl alcohol is used. You don't want to use denatured alcohol that is

  made with anything that shouldn't be placed on the skin, such as gasoline!

   

  So, some, but not all, kinds of denatured alcohol can be used as rubbing

  alcohol. Rubbing alcohol may also not contain any ethanol at all, which

  would disqualify it from being "denatured". So, some but not all kinds of

  rubbing alcohol are denatured alcohol, and some but not all kinds of

  denatured alcohol can be rubbing alcohol.

   

  Richard E. Barrans Jr., Ph.D.

  Assistant Director

  PG Research Foundation, Darien, Illinois

1495

Dermarolling / Microneedling / Deep needling and subscision question-

« on: June 28, 2011, 03:18:57 PM »

You can do this procedure indefinitely, until you are happy with your results.  It usually takes 6-8 procedures to see results. I corrected my sentence in this thread https://http://forums.owndoc.com/dermarolling-microneedling/Subcision-frequency /a>

  because I did not make it clear and it was actually misleading. I am sorry.

  You can do it indefinitely but if you do not see results after 6-8 procedures, there is no reason to continue. I am very happy that you do get results.

1496

Dermarolling / Microneedling / single needling, dermarolling, frequency, etc

« on: June 28, 2011, 03:04:16 PM »

Stamp the same scar six to eight times. You should get about 250 pricks per cm2 (our dermastamp has 35 needles).  If you heal OK you can stamp slightly more densely the next time, especially if you have seriously deep scars. You have to experiment a little.

    Pricking one acne scar twenty times is OK for the single needle method but a dermastamp has 35 needles and more than one needle will hit the scar so twenty times would be too much - at least to begin with.

Yes you can roll all over your face, including your stamped scars. However, do not roll over the scars if they have scabs from stamping. It would prematurely remove the scabs and that could cause scarring. Scabs have to fall off by themselves when they are ready. Not everybody gets scabs, but if you do, do not roll over them until they are gone.

1497

Dermarolling / Microneedling / What happens when you needle healthy skin?

« on: June 28, 2011, 02:39:55 PM »

The single needle can be used on any type of skin skin but because single needling is a method to treat scars, you should concentrate on the scars and not on the surrounding skin. You want to trigger collagen in the scar or crush the hardened scar collagen so your main concern is the scar tissue. I merely wanted to explain that when you needle your stretch marks or acne scars for example, you needle the scar and its edges but you do not have to needle the scar-free skin around it because it would take you forever and it is not necessary. Perhaps I should rephrase the instructions.

   Being prone to keloids is extremely rare but I ask our customers to do a test patch just to be on the safe side. If you were prone to keloids, you would most likely already know that from past experiences.  Here I explain the difference between an ordinary scar and a keloid:

   

  https://http://forums.owndoc.com/dermarolling-microneedling/burn-scars-and-hyperthropic-scars/

1498

Dermarolling / Microneedling / Single Needling and Aftercare Questions

« on: June 28, 2011, 02:26:09 PM »

Single needling of acne scars is explained in our dermarolling instructions:

   CHAPTER 8 - SINGLE NEEDLE FOR INDIVIDUAL SCARS AND WRINKLES

   

  (Paragraph: Sparse needling: Acne / chickenpox scars or individual wrinkles.)

   

  https://http://dermaroller.owndoc.com/dermaroller-instructions.pdf

   

If you have any specific further questions after reading it, just ask.

 

 You do not necessarily have to use Infadolan but keep the skin very much moisturized after dermarolling or needling.

   Regarding Hyaluronic acid:

   

  https://http://forums.owndoc.com/dermarolling-microneedling/can-I-use-the-Hyaluronic-acid-serum-100-pure

1499

Dermarolling / Microneedling / The Dermaroller Trademark Does not Qualify for Trademark Protection

« on: June 28, 2011, 12:05:26 PM »

Edelgard Liebl registered on the 29th of August, 2006 the word trademark "TOP-ROL DERMAROLLER" as an EU trademark.

And on the 19th of November, 2008 he registered a picture mark with the word "Dermaroller" prominently visible as a EU trademark.

On April 8, 2008, he registered the word "Dermaroller" as a US trademark.

On this basis, Cynergy, the US agent of Dermaroller S.a.r.l. has filed lawsuits against the sellers of dermarollers in the US:

https://http://www.dermarollerus.com/press/dermaroller-enforcing-us-trademarks

https://http://www.justanswer.com/intellectual-property-law/4sdip-hi-paul-linda-robison-here-in-august-2009-asked.html

https://http://www.articlesnatch.com/Article/Dermaroller---Files-First-Wave-Of-Federal-Trademark-Lawsuits-Against-Online-Micro-needle-Resellers/2217572

We are quite sure these suits will be found without merit, we are quite sure Dermaroller S.a.r.l. knows this, and we think that the only reason the lawsuits have been filed is to bankrupt small dermaroller vendors to spend money on legal representation, and discourage others to stop selling dermarollers.

The reason is that the "Dermaroller" trademark simply is not a valid legal trademark, even though it has been registered as such in the US (not in Europe). Only when a trademark becomes contested, or when a trademark infringement lawsuit takes place, it will become known whether a trademark actually qualifies for legal protection. It is the same with patents. Anyone who pays the fees can file a patent or trademark, even when they are obviously non-enforceable. The trademark registration office does not verify whether a trademark qualifies for protection - they just register.

Let's look at US trademark law:

https://http://cyber.law.harvard.edu/metaschool/fisher/domain/tm.htm



"a generic mark is a mark that describes the general category to which the underlying product belongs. For example, the term "Computer" is a generic term for computer equipment. Generic marks are entitled to no protection under trademark law. Thus, a manufacturer selling "Computer" brand computers (or "Apple" brand apples, etc.) would have no exclusive right to use that term with respect to that product. Generic terms are not protected by trademark law because they are simply too useful for identifying a particular product. Giving a single manufacturer control over use of the term would give that manufacturer too great a competitive advantage. "

"Dermaroller" is such a generic mark. It simply means "Skin roller". Derma = Greek for skin.

Therefore, the word "Dermaroller" is a generic, descriptive term for the actual product Dermaroller S.a.r.l. sells, and can't possibly qualify for trademark protection.

Dermaroller S.a.r.l. never trademarked the single word "Dermaroller" in Europe, so European vendors do not have to fear a lawsuit.

"Dermaroller" may also perhaps be considered or claimed to be a descriptive mark, and also in that case, Dermaroller S.a.r.l. does not enjoy legal trademark protection on the term:

"A descriptive mark is a mark that directly describes, rather than suggests, a characteristic or quality of the underlying product (e.g. its color, odor, function, dimensions, or ingredients). For example, "Holiday Inn," "All Bran," and "Vision Center" all describe some aspect of the underlying product or service (respectively, hotel rooms, breakfast cereal, optical services). They tell us something about the product. Unlike arbitrary or suggestive marks, descriptive marks are not inherently distinctive and are protected only if they have acquired "secondary meaning." Descriptive marks must clear this additional hurdle because they are terms that are useful for describing the underlying product, and giving a particular manufacturer the exclusive right to use the term could confer an unfair advantage.

A descriptive mark acquires secondary meaning when the consuming public primarily associates that mark with a particular producer, rather than the underlying product."

It is easy to show that the word "Dermaroller" has been used, worldwide, by consumers to mean any type of microneedling skin roller, and not specifically and near-exclusively the products of Dermaroller S.a.r.l.

We can prove this by doing a Google forum search on a date range stopping at the registration dates of their trademarks:

In 2001:

https://http://board.beauty24.de/showthread.php?t=8626

In 2002:

https://http://www.hairlosshelp.com/FORUMS/messageview.cfm?catid=31&threadid=11545

So the word "Dermaroller" was already genericized before their trademark application, and certainly is genericized today, which is amply obvious to anyone doing an online search for the term. Genericized trademarks lose their protection under US trademark law:

https://http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Genericized_trademark

So what is the status of the alleged "Dermaroller" trademark?

In the EU: No single "Dermaroller" word trademark has ever been registered.

In the US: A "Dermaroller" trademark has been registered but it never fulfilled the legal requirements for registration, so it can't be enforced. Any court cases will be lost by Dermaroller S.a.r.l., if any trademark attorney worth his salt will get involved.

What does this all mean for us, OwnDoc.com? We operate a Seychelles Limited. That company came with a US correspondence address (listed on our website), but we do not have a physical presence in the US. We dispatch from Europe and we pay tax in Europe.

1500

Dermarolling / Microneedling / Welts on Skin After Dermarolling

« on: June 25, 2011, 10:55:20 AM »

I am very pleased you are getting results with the single needles.

   

  I hope that the skin problem will totally disappear over time. To be honest, I still do not know what the cause could be.