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Author Topic: single needling bruises  (Read 16650 times)

HaleyRyan09

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single needling bruises
« on: May 10, 2010, 02:32:14 AM »
Hi Sarah,

I single needled the stretch marks on my upper arms 5 days after rolling them with a 1.5 mm roller. Your single needle tapers off at 2 mm so I didn't think it was possible to go too deep when single needling since, from what I read, the single needles are used with the purpose of getting deeper into the scarred skin than the roller. Well, I must have still gone too deep because I ended up with really bad bruising all over both of my arms. Not every prick I  made caused a bruise, but a lot of them did because I had about 4 pretty big bruises the next day on each arm. I've had to cover the area for over a week now because the bruises are still there and it looks like I was beaten or something. I want to make sure this doesn't happen again. I single needled the stretchmarks on my legs and this never happened. Is it that the skin on my arms is much thinner and that's what caused this?

Thanks in advance.

SarahVaughter

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single needling bruises
« Reply #1 on: May 11, 2010, 01:53:01 PM »
Yes, the skin on the arms is thinner than that on the legs.

 

 It is impossible to sell a universal length needle that fits every skin condition and every part of the body, because firstly: Skin thickness varies significantly, depending on what part of the body it covers. The thinnest skin is on the eyelids (0.5 mm or less) the thickest is on the soles of the feet. The back and the buttocks have thick skin as well.

 Secondly, it also varies individually. We have customers that roll their face with a 2 mm roller and  they get no pinpoint bleeding and we have customers that roll their face with 0.5 mm and they get quite some pinpoint bleeding. And men usually have thicker skin than women.

 I am really sorry it caused you bruising on your arms but the good news  is that the release of blood may infact improve your stretchmarks. You caused a microwound to the skin, the body will fix it and fill the microwound with  new skin. That is the principle behind dermarolling and in fact, the literature suggests that blood plasma helps with this process. Do not get me wrong. You do not have to cause bleeding in order to improve the stretchmarks but apart from the cosmetic problem of being bruised, you do not have to worry too much about it either. Some surgeons even use dermarollers with 3 mm needles. We can even order those for our customers.

 You should not needle deeper than occasional pinpoint bleeding but the line between pinpoint bleeding and getting bruises is a fine line and it is difficult to guess.the best is to try a small patch first. Our needles have a "safety stop" at around 2 mm, but some needles are longer than others, so that you can choose which one suits a particular skin area best. You should not always put the needle in until it can't go any further - not on thin skin in any case.

 The skin consists of the epidermis, the dermis and the subdermis (fat layer).

 

 The epidermis has no blood supply at all.  If you get pinpoint bleeding it means you reached the dermis. The dermis has irregular tiny blood vessels and the deeper you go into the dermis, the more blood vessels there are. If you reach the deeper parts of the dermis where there are many bloodvessels, you could end up with bruises.

 

 Stretchmarks reside in  the dermis. As said, skin thickness is not the same all over the body, unfortunately.

 

You can adjust the needle length with a toothpick, so that you can let them penetrate only a mm, for example:  

 https://http://forums.owndoc.com/dermarolling-microneedling/Adjusting-the-length-of-the-single-needle

 

 The "toothpick solution" is not ideal but it's the best we found so far. So, next time when you needle your arms, use a toothpick to make it shorter.  

 

 We are trying to improve our products to our customers'  needs and I hope we can find a better solution. As I explained, it is impossible to sell a universal length that would be perfect for every condition and every customer. We still haven't found a needle manufacturer that can produce the perfect needle in a range of perfectly accurate lengths in the mm range. I hope next year we will have found such a supplier, but the current needles are in fact very good already, as long as you are aware that for some skin, they are a bit too long and should be either not pushed in to the hilt, or shortened with a taped toothpick to the shaft.

 Regarding bruises: You can use a cream containing heparin (available OTC in pharmacies), which will make the bruises disappear quicker. Do not apply Heparin cream immediately after needling (do not use it on "open" skin). Wait one day.  

 

Haley I am sorry you got bruises! Hopefully you'lll be rewarded with a solid improvement of your stretch marks.

soon

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single needling bruises
« Reply #2 on: May 20, 2011, 05:13:13 AM »
Hi Sarah,

Hope you can help.....the last 2 times I've used the single needles I think I hit a blood vessel.

Both times its been near my "crows feet". I must stress that its not near my eye. It happens between my hairline & eye. Also its happened the left side & right.

Almost instantly after I prick, a lump forms then takes a few hours to recede & finally it turns into something that looks like a bruise. Unfortunately the last one has been there for 2 weeks.

Am I doing something wrong? The first 2 times I didn't get this reaction.

As always thanks for taking the time to respond,

Cheers soon

SarahVaughter

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single needling bruises
« Reply #3 on: May 22, 2011, 07:21:08 AM »
I am really sorry about this.
 

  You should stop using the single needle. It is obviously not suitable for individuals with thin skin around and near the eyes. I have needled the wrinkles between my eyebrows and never got anything except pinpoint bleeding that healed very quickly but certain facial areas are clearly too thin for the single needle.
 

  The single needles are excellent for acne scars, scars and stretch marks but I have to change our documentation about where the needles should not be used to avoid this problem.

   We can send you shorter single needles for free or we can refund you for the needles.

   If you want hand-selected shorter single needles, send me an email and include your address.

UPDATE

Our current single needles are shorter - 1.85 mm.
« Last Edit: September 02, 2013, 02:55:56 PM by SarahVaughter »

soon

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single needling bruises
« Reply #4 on: May 22, 2011, 09:40:20 AM »
Hi Sarah,

I'm thinking due to the glycolic acid, maybe my skin has thinned

in that area so I will stop single needelling it.

No need for a refund as I use them on other spots also.

Just glad to hear I wasn't doing something incorrect :)

It's nice the world didn't end today ..... hehee

Cheers soon

FINLEY

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single needling bruises
« Reply #5 on: May 23, 2011, 06:42:36 PM »
Sarah, always a "class act," showing concern for your customers vs business/ financial concerns.  I continue to be impressed by your professionalism!

cfg

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Re: single needling bruises
« Reply #6 on: September 02, 2013, 02:54:13 PM »
Hi Sarah,

I was also wondering if I went too deep when single needling stretch marks on my inner thights. I got two tiny bruises on one stretch mark but almost all of them have pintpoint bleeding. You mentioned that one shouldn't needle deeper than ocassional pintpoint bleeding. If in a stretch mark of 3cm of lenght there can be clearly seen 5-10 of these bleeding spots is that too much?

How long should the redness last after single needling? My marks were white before starting and now they are acctually very red and there has been 24 hours after single needlng. I understand that some redness is normal but I am slightly worried that I went too deep and made the marks worse.

I also used a 1,5mm dermaroller a week ago and the reddness only lasted an hour.

Thanks

SarahVaughter

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Re: single needling bruises
« Reply #7 on: September 03, 2013, 09:43:01 AM »
Pinpoint bleeding as you described (or even more) is completely normal and even tiny bruises are OK. You should not be getting big, serious bruises.
 
Single needling is much more intensive and targeted than dermarolling and the redness after single needling can last for days. Some residual redness can even last for weeks. It is all OK.

jnl11

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Re: single needling bruises
« Reply #8 on: September 03, 2013, 09:20:16 PM »
I have been single needling my lip wrinkles.  I found that if I am careful to avoid taking ibuprofen and fish oil for 4-7 days prior to needling (and a few days after), I have practically no bruising/discoloration by the next day.  Which is surprising as I needle aggressively, pushing the needle to its stopping point. (I use numbing cream so needling is tolerable).  The first time I needled I was taking fish oil daily and had bruising for over 4 days.   

SarahVaughter

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Re: single needling bruises
« Reply #9 on: September 05, 2013, 04:12:10 PM »
You are brave because from my experience this area is painful to microneedle even with a numbing cream.
 
Ibuprofen and other nonsteroidal anti-inflammatory drugs reduce blood clotting and thus increase bleeding.
 
Fish oil supposedly also reduces blood clotting.
 
They should be avoided prior to major surgeries where significant bleeding is expected.
 
Microneedling only involves very minor pinpoint bleeding so it is not really contradicted but to reduce/shorten the bruising, it is better to avoid them at least 24 hours prior to microneedling and right after.