Sarah Vaughter answers questions about OwnDoc products
Forums => Dermarolling / Microneedling => Topic started by: kakalakingma on December 05, 2010, 09:25:42 AM
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: kakalakingma on December 05, 2010, 09:25:42 AM
Hi everyone,
Recently I have been breaking out and I have not experienced this kind of acne breakout in a LONG time. Plus, I would not want to use my derma roller over bumps. Gosh, just imagine already having ugly red blemishes and then turning your whole face into a tomato after rolling. OUCH? :mad: I strongly believe it is better to have a acne-free skin before treating the depressing acne scars that are left behind with the derma roller. My acne is most likely due to stresses from school, out of whack sleeping schedule, and horrible food choice. I have a pretty decent skin care routine should fight my acne. However, I am very interested to get some possibly new insights from you, the forum members, here on your product recommendations along with tips and tricks on handling acne.
Here is my skin care routine:
Daytime
Cleanser: Olay Foaming Face Wash, Sensitive Skin
Toner: Neutrogena Alcohol Free Toner (nothing special in this product besides a few humectants. I just like the refreshing feeling of the damp cotton rounds as I wipe it all over my face. Also, the damp cotton round catches dead skin cells, which is nice.)
Plus, about 1X every two weeks I use Biore Deep Cleansing Pore Strips to remove blackheads on my nose. None of my skin care products above has ever improve my blackheads or pore size. Only this Biore product temporarily make my pore look unclogged. Any tips on maintaining blackhead-free nose is appreciated!
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: Anna on December 05, 2010, 10:59:13 AM
if your acne is hormonal you pretty much will have a really hard time clesring it unless you take some kind of a hormone regulating supplement ir if you want to do it the easy way birth control pills assuming you're a woman. But it sounds like your cause maybe your diet so if you want to get clear eat as much as fresh begetables and fruit as you can. Stay away from fast food, fried food, pizza, candy, soda, anything with sugar in it basically. I had s rash of acne under my jaw/upper neck and I started on a new diet this weekall veggies anf fruit and nuts and it already cleared up 3 days later. I'm no expert on this Sarah would probably have better more substantial answers for you but thus is just what works foe me.
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: Anna on December 05, 2010, 11:05:46 AM
also on a side note it looks like you're using a LOT of products on your face perhaps overdoing it. Try giving your skin a break and juts wash once a day at night and put nothing else on it just wash it. I like burts bees chamomille cream cleanser it's very gentle, and being gentle on acne skin is key. There wa sone poing I only washed my face with water and my skin never looked better until I got the hormonal breakouts this past couple of months which I'm suspecting I threw myself off balance due to some itamins I was taking that had chaste tree(vitex) in it. Also try this too burts bees pore refining mask it comes in powder form and mix it with grapeseed oil and do this twice a day along with washing your face once a day it will clear you up fast. Yeah loong story, good luck though.
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: kakalakingma on December 05, 2010, 08:53:41 PM
Oh, wow this is so nice I got some feedback. Thanks you so much, Anna.
First of all I am a 20 year old male. I have oily to very oily skin type since the beginning of puberty. And my skin is quite influenced by hormone fluctuation from stress and bad diet.
I tend to avoid creamy consistency because they feel heavy on my face. Besides, I have very oily skin, so I really want to steer away from excess emollient ingredient and other oils.
I like your diet plan of fruits and vegetables. I bought myself fruits from Target but not eating any vegetables. lol. But I will buy some salad and eat for a week. I should also include fish for the anti-inflammatory Omegas or substitute with flaxseed oil to my diet. I really appreciate your feedback.
I do want to address your comment about putting too much on my face. I say otherwise. The cleanser and scrub are rinsed off every time. The toner is mostly water that will eventually evaporate and leaving behind a minute amount of water-binding ingredients like butylene glycol, panthenol, and NaPCA that will bind some moisture. The same thing goes with my BHA liquid and sunblock liquid because the watery consistency is very thin on my skin. Additionally, the BHA exfoliant functions as the needed antibacterial and oil-soluble keratoylic agent. So I don't think my skin is being overly saturated with ingredients with most of my leave-on products are serums, gels, and/or liquids. The only product that is "creamy" and "thick" and really feels like it stays on is my tretinoin cream. And that's only one product applied mainly at night. after I finish the cream tretinoin I am going to buy Sarah's gel version.
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: kakalakingma on December 06, 2010, 03:24:09 AM
"Got acne or even just the occasional zit? Yeah, I'm with ya. Or at least I was, until I sat down with a few dermatologists to pin down all the many, many reasons I was breaking out. The shocker: I was doing sooo many things wrong, and I don't think I'm alone. So I figured I should share their top 13 sneaky causes of acne (get the full list here) so we can all have clear skin. No need to thank me.
But first, a random zit fact: did you know that acne-prone people are born with about four to five times more skin cells than the average person?! Crazy, right? Click here if you want to see some more acne trivia.
Sneaky Acne Cause No. 1: Pressure (literally)
Dermatologist Dr. Ava Shamban says there is -- get this -- pressure-induced acne. So if you're constantly talking on your cell phone, playing violin, resting your hand on your chin, you're giving your skin a double whammy. One, most of those surfaces are covered in bacteria and two, the actual pressure of those things on your face can cause acne. Click here to see how you can fix the problem.
Sneaky Acne Cause No. 2: Pressure (figuratively)
You already know that stress can get your heart racing and your stomach churning, but did you know that it also increases hormones that can cause breakouts? While you can't realistically knock all the stress out of your life (ha, wouldn't that be nice?), you can try to relax and minimize the drama. Say it with me now, ohmmmmm ...
Sneaky Acne Cause No. 3: Your Pillowcase or Towel
This is a multi-dimensional problem. One, your face lies on your pillowcase for hours at a time, and if it's not clean you're basically pressing a bunch of dead skin and bacteria onto your skin (lovely). Same deal with your towel -- your skin might be fresh from the shower, but if the towel isn't clean you're just wiping germs onto your face.
Annet King, director of The International Dermal Institute, suggests changing your pillowcase once or twice a week and using a fresh towel daily. However, that's only one part of the problem. If you use fabric softeners and dryer sheets they could also be causing breakouts. Turns out, the stuff that makes your clothes soft is tallow, which is -- wait for it -- animal fat. Ew. I don't know about you, but I don't want that on my face. Plus, detergents and fabric softeners with lots of fragrance can cause irritation as well.
Sneaky Acne Cause No. 4: Over-Drying Your Skin
Sure, it makes sense at first glance: if you dry out oily skin with harsh cleansers, alcohol-based toners and skip the moisturizer, your skin won't be oily anymore. But ... it doesn't really work like that.
Instead, drying out your skin this way will cause it to up its oil production, making the whole situation worse. King explains that the skin tries to correct itself and so if it feels dry it will begin to produce more oil to balance things out. See what you can do to keep your skin hydrated but not greasy here.
Sneaky Acne Cause No. 5: Tanning
Back in the day, people used to recommend tanning to clear up skin. And in the short term it does kind of work. The sun dries out your skin and UV rays do have an antibacterial element, but tanning is so not the way to go. For one, we already learned that over-drying your skin will cause it to produce more oil.
Also, tanning causes your skin to increase cell production (which means more dead skin cells), so while you might get a bit clearer at first, tanning will end up giving you more breakouts. And don't even get me started on all the skin damage, cancer risks and wrinkle issues.
Sneaky Acne Cause No. 6: Your Hair Products
What's that you say? You don't put hair products on your skin? Well, unless you consistently wear your hair in a slicked back ponytail and never let a strand near your face, I'd say that's just not true.
King says hair products with oil, silicones and plasticizers can clog your pores, and if you wear your hair down, have bangs or even sleep with your hair loose it can get on your face and work it's non-magic. So keep the products to a minimum and keep your hair off your face as much as possible. These hot updos and ponytail ideas are just the ticket."
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: Anna on December 06, 2010, 08:19:14 AM
I like that article everything is right on target and I do every single thing on the list to prevent zits. Anyway as far as the product usage if iall that is working for you great! Continue using it but seeing that you're still getting breakouts you might want to try and cut down. Even though you wash the cleanser off and the scrub you're stripping your skin of the natural oils and that makes it produce even more oil so thus I wash it once a day with a creamy cleanse that keeps my skin soft so I don't have a need for a moisturizer although I do use one only 2 to 3 times a week. The point I'm trying to make is your skin has the ability to fix itself without all that unnecessary stuff like toners scrub whatever the bha is and what not even scars( except I don't feel like waiting decades for the natural regeneration so that's where dermaroller comes in haha) anyway I don't go to dermatologists anymore I try to take care of my problem on my own because when I used to see one they would put me on endless anntibiotics and told me a bad diet won't cause my acne. So whatever I dont have a lot of faith in traditional doctors anymore they're full of it. My theory is if everyone was healthy and acne free they would be out of a job so they want to make sure you keep coming back by putting you on alll kinds of crap and further ruining your health.
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: kakalakingma on December 06, 2010, 09:47:16 AM
Anna,
I am glad that you like the article! Also, I used to follow the tips from the article very well until recently I got into bad stress and eating habits. Yeah..life. LOL. Let me address some things in your previous feedback above:
I believe any cleansers with surfactant detergents such as those derived from coconut will strip a certain amount of oils. I think your skin only produce more oils as a response to an irritation. From what I have researched, it is over-stripping your skin of its natural oils with cleaners consisting of too much detergents or one or more types of harsh detergents (e.g., Sodium C14 16 Olefin Sulfonate or Sodium Lauryl Sulfate). I testify that the cleanser I used, Olay Foaming Face Wash, Sensitive Skin, does not overly degrease my skin at all; my skin does not feel "squeaky" clean. Actually, sometimes when I had my long days, I tend to use the cleansers 2X to remove all that nasty excessive greased built throughout the day. Yeah, I am an oil-slick. I hate it. I might need to reuse the Neutrogena Acne Wash with Sodium C14 16 Olefin Sulfonate because that cleanser give me squeaky clean result. LOL. Another thing that I have read else that can cause your oil glands to produce more oils is to repeatedly used alcohol-based toners on a daily basis. Or irritation from artificial fragrance and dyes assuming they do irritate your skin. If your creamy cleanser work for you (perhaps you have normal to dry, sometime combination skin types?), then great!
I agree with you, Anna, about the toner and scrub that I used. I don't really need them. I used the toner because I like the feeling of the damped cotton pad over my face. I used the scrub because I like the feeling of scrubbing my face (gently, of course). BHA stands for beta hydroxy acid or most likely known as salicylic acid in the world of cosmetic dermatology. It has good research support its antibacterial, anti-inflammatory, and oil-soluble exfoliating abilities. A fabulous ingredient to incorporate into your routine, especially for acne prone skin may I add.
I am not so sure I am all there with you on the "your skin has the ability to fix itself ... [and] natural regeneration" when it comes to scars. I have so many acne scars on my face (it's depressing at times; but I try to get over it) and a few I remember for nearly many years going on a decade soon. I think it depends on the type of scars. But I do believe once a skin tissue is dead and gone from collage depletion or whatever, you have a depressed scar that last... for a life time. Of course, you can smooth it out with chemical peels and what not, but I say it stays. I am hoping the derma roller to give me hope. So I agree with you on the derma roller, ha ha.
You are so lucky you get to go to a dermatologist. I do not have that luxury. I have so many questions it is exhausting to count.
I feel bad that you lost faith in dermatologists. Maybe just bad experience with bad dermatologists. I hope. I know you know this, but I will just address it. They don't just handle people with acne. There are a variety of things you should go to your dermatologist for. I can think of several on the top of my head right now: Skin Cancer screening, Botox, Intense Pulsed Light (broken capillaries), Non-/Ablative Lasers (scars, pigmentation; say if derma rollin is not working as you like), Fillers. Now that's just the cosmetic dermatology. There are dermatologist who love to help people with rosacea, psoriasis, melanoma, eczema, vitiligo, autoimmune skin diseases, and the list goes on. Anna, trust me, even if everyone is acne free, cosmetic dermatologist or just regular dermatologist won't go out of business because there are a plethora of problems with beauty that can make a profit out of. We are a long way from cures and perfection.. that is all wishful thinking... for now.
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: Anna on December 06, 2010, 12:32:00 PM
let me clarify what I meant about your skin having the ability to fix itself and natural regeneration. In my experience if I eat healthy my skin looks healthy and breakout free, if I don't eat healthy I get breakouts. If I'm under a lot of stress or using too much or the wrong product, I breakout. Ten years ago I had a rash of acne after my daughter was born and left me with pretty deep scarring, and now a decade later it's almost 95% improved and I haven't done anything fancy at a doctors office, or used some miracle creams it just filled in on it's own. That's what I meant by the natural regeneration the skin renews itself it's constantly shedding dead skin and renewing itself he only downside is it took a decade and I don't want to wait another decade for the rest of the newer scarring to heal so I'm doing dermaroller. As far as the toner if you like the feeling the toner gives your skin you could just soak a regular cotton pad with water and do that instead.
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: kakalakingma on December 06, 2010, 07:26:40 PM
Oh I tried it with water, I guess there is a slight difference texture of the liquid of toner vs. water. I think that is fantastic that, in your case, your acne scar heals extremely well. I mean, 95% is amazing. What was your skin care routine during the decade? What is your skin care routine nowadays? What is your skin type?
The only thing I am not sure about is whether or not shedding of skin equal building collagen and replacing lost skin tissue from acne scar.
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: Anna on December 07, 2010, 08:15:47 AM
well I've always used natural producta on my skin with natural ingredients like camocare and burts bees. My skin used to be ridiculously oily until I realised the food I was eating was the cause.. Now my skin is I would say combo I get oily in the tzone and my pores are quite small now that it's not oily all over like before. Right now I use burts bees chamomille cleanser and a moisturizer by skin organics called vanilla acai. Although I will be trying a cleanser too from that line because the lotion has been very good to my skin. I do remember though using vitamin c in capsules avon used to sell those I'm not sure if they do still so maybe there a link there, maybe it was the vitamin c. The only scarring that has nor changed at all are my chicken pox scars I've had for about 20 years so that's something I'm hoping the roller will imrove too.
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: SarahVaughter on December 07, 2010, 11:59:45 AM
I hope that more people will share here their personal experience and advice concerning acne!
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: Anna on December 08, 2010, 08:09:30 AM
you asked for help I offered it. There's no need to challenge me on my knowledge of what's natural and what isn't. Good luck to you.
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: kakalakingma on December 08, 2010, 09:20:26 AM
I didn't mean to imply any mean tone with that. My apology. I was just being zealous like I said.
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: Anna on December 11, 2010, 08:32:23 PM
that's ok I can be overly sensitive sometimes haha let me know how the diet of fruit and vegetables is working for you :)
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: kakalakingma on December 15, 2010, 06:09:54 AM
Anna, I am so glad we are cool. LOL. My skin is better. I am lacking vegetables still! But my face is good so far. I think I get to user the derma roller soon!
Anyway, I have found some useful links for forum readers here if anyone is interested!
From DERMAdoctor, an article titled, "Acne - topical therapies", in which she talks extensively on the list of topical therapies but also lasers and lights. She lists some product suggestions that are quite pricey. She does not include published research, though. Her commentary are simple and clean and easy to understand.
From DermTV, I found this website run by dermatologist, Dr. Schultz, where he frequently post videos and answers his internet followers' questions regarding skin care and dermatology. Here are specific links to questions and video pages of which he targets the topic of acne: Q & A on Acne; Videos on Acne. His videos and responses to questions are brief, but can still be of interests to some who wants quick insights (not necessarily solid answers) on problems they have!
From CosmeticsCop, I have know this lady for a while now and I trust much of her products and work. She composed a well organized piece of treatments on acne. She has succinct writing and her opinion is backed with published research (for those you wants to read studies and reviews).
Update on my regimen: I have incorporated Clearasil Adult Acne Treatment Cream Tinted with 2% resorcinol and 8% sulfur. It has help my skin looks better; I am less oily visibly and I have less pimples (clearing still). The first night I applied it I got a little tingly sensation, but none of it the following day. I guess that means my skin has adapted to the ingredients. I apply it at night and benzoyl peroxide in the morning.:)
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: kakalakingma on December 21, 2010, 06:41:08 AM
Hi forum members!
I have been searching the web for more information and I came across ingredients interaction that has to do with benzoyl peroxide. According to Wikipedia, benzoyl peroxide functions as an oxidizing agent in order to destroy acne bacteria:
"The oxygen-oxygen bond in peroxides is weak. Thus benzoyl peroxide readily undergoes homolysis (symmetrical scission), forming free radicals:
The "•" is represent the radical. Homolysis is the chemical reaction that generation free radicals (LINK). Even though benzoyl peroxide is prepare through hydrogen peroxide and benzoyl chloride, it is important to understand that this is NOT the same thing as hydrogen peroxide and its ability to generate oxidative stress on the skin: "2 H2O2 → 2 H2O + O2". We usually know that free radicals are from oxygen. I have not found a piece of research on the benefit of hydrogen peroxide on acne, but there is an abundant amount of research on benzoyl peroxide, however! There is a piece of research stating that the inflammation from acne increase hydrogen peroxide production by neutrophils (STUDY LINK)
Though I will say that I am not sure if all forms of free radical damage from different compound does the same level of damage. According to Dr. Todorov, "you are right BP is pro-oxidant. However, inflammation from acne is also pro-oxidant. For people with severe acne, for whom BP is the only remedy that works, it might be a lesser "evil" that leaving acne untreated. But it may be better to try other acne remedies first. Talk to your dermatologist." (LINK)
With that said, you should NOT use your vitamin C or any antioxidant serums simultaneously because their innate chemical functions end up canceling their benefits. Another one is Tretinoin, "Tretinoin and benzoyl peroxide neutralize each other when applied at the same time. " (LINK). In sum, use benzoyl peroxide medication and antioxidant/Retin-A products at opposite end of the day!
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: Anna on December 21, 2010, 03:03:14 PM
that's interesting I'm glad I don't use bp I use herbs like comfrey mixed with grapeseed oil and dot it on individual spots it works and it doesn't irritate my skin at all
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: Anna on December 21, 2010, 03:08:27 PM
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: kakalakingma on December 26, 2010, 01:38:28 PM
Hi forum members!
Okay, so I have been researching benzoyl peroxide and I came across a summary article posted on "acne.org" regarding the FDA review on OTC benzoyl peroxide. The FDA concluded that the use of benzoyl peroxide is SAFE AND EFFECTIVE. I pasted the summary here:
"The safety of Benzoyl Peroxide is periodically brought up by board members as an area of concern. Questions about whether it may increase skin cancer risk or cause DNA damage (and thus damage or accelarate the aging the skin) are the most common concerns. Given those concerns, I thought this information from the FDA was important to share with the messageboard members.
The FDA has updated its safety classification of Benzoyl Peroxide to a Category I (Safe and Effective). In 1991, the classification was listed as a type III, which meant that more data was needed before the FDA could determine the actual safety classification (it was never considered to be "unsafe" though). The body of the research conducted since that time has lead the FDA to change the classification to a safe and effective. I have the full article from the Federal Registry, for those who are interested in reading more details. I plan to post it in another thread. The abstract is below, and I highlighted a few points from the article as well.
Classification of Benzoyl Peroxide as Safe and Effective and Revision of Labeling to Drug Facts Format; Topical Acne Drug Products for Over-The-Counter Human Use; Final Rule
AGENCY: Food and Drug Administration,HHS.
ACTION: Final rule.
SUMMARY: We, the Food and Drug Administration (FDA), are issuing this final rule to include benzoyl peroxide as a generally recognized as safe and effective (GRASE) active ingredient in over-the-counter (OTC) topical acne drug products. In addition, this final rule includes new warnings and directions required for OTC acne drug products containing benzoyl peroxide. We are also revising labeling for OTC topical acne drug products containing resorcinol, resorcinol monoacetate, salicylic acid and/or sulfur to meet OTC drug labeling content and format
requirements in a certain FDA regulation. This final rule is part of our ongoing review of OTC drug products and represents our conclusions on benzoyl peroxide in OTC acne drug products.
Additional points of interest:
-They did not find BPO to be a genotoxic substance, which basically means they do not believe that it damages DNA. They go on to add that even though BPO has been shown in research to create oxidative damage, that in humans, there are oxidative repair mechanisms that would likely prevent benzoyl peroxide from causing DNA damage.
-They did not find BPO to be carcinogenic. They state: "We have reviewed a number of animal studies examining the carcinogenic potential of benzoyl peroxide and conclude that benzoyl peroxide is not a carcinogen." They also determined that there was no evidence to indicate that BPO is a photocarcinogen.
They are requiring an update to the warning labels on BPO products as well. Any OTC products that contain BPO will need to have the following warnings on the label:
• Avoiding unnecessary sun exposure
• Not using on very sensitive skin
• Keeping away from the eyes, lips, and mouth
• Cautioning that benzoyl peroxide may bleach hair or dye fabric
They will also require a direction for drug products containing benzoyl
peroxide to use a sunscreen when going outside." (ARTICLE LINK)
If you prefer to read the WHOLE thing, you want to visit THIS GOV. LINK.
Well, my skin has gotten CLEARER!!! Okay, last week, I got a little confident with the products and I layer 10% benzoyl peroxide over my Clearasil product (with 8% sulfur and 2% resorcinol) --- a day or two later my skin got very itchy and peeling. I had to use OTC 1% hydrocortisone cream from Aveeno and it got better. Phew! So, please don't try to be impatient with your skin and act brave and apply two strong strong product just to be aggressive with your pimples AND YOUR WHOLE FACE. I am apply 10% benzoyl peroxide in the morning and Clearasil at night.
I think I will discontinue 10% benzoyl peroxide and return to 2.5% benzoyl peroxide, which I will buy for cheap at acne.org. Acne.org offer affordable and bulk benzoyl peroxide products with not a lot of nonsensical ingredients in them.
[Update: Acne.org also offer an 10% glycolic acid product with a pH of 4.0-4.1.]
[Update 2: I want to add that I also apply that Clearasil product on my nose. It actually has help with the appearance of my blackheads problem, but not complete... yet?]
[Update 3: Here is my updated skin care products:
Daytime
Cleanser: Neutrogena Fresh Foaming Cleanser
Scrub: Neutrogena Deep Clean Daily Long-Last Shine Control Scrub
Toner: Neutrogena Alcohol Free Toner (I rarely use this now. I just finishing it up. I use it when I have a lot of flakes)
Scrubs: Neutrogena Deep Clean Daily Long-Last Shine Control Scrub or St. Ives Naturally Clear Green Tea Scrub (maybe 3-5X per week; I switch them around for fun. I am almost out of the latter)
Hi Anna, I have read the whole article and dang, it was loooonnnggg. LOL. I have pasted the parts I find interesting. I do note that the good reviews of comfrey came mostly if not only from anecdotal evidence. Also, the author is on the defense of comfrey oral and topical use. He claims that there are lobbyists that are at fault for making comfrey look bad. Only one way to know.. RESEARCH for yourself.
“This action, together with comfrey’s allantoin properties (a cell proliferant) provides us with a very powerful herb. Allantoin is one of the elements that makes comfrey unique. Allantoin is also produced in the allantois gland of the umbilical cord (the link between mother and developing baby, which feeds the embryo) for promoting rapid cell growth. Mothers’ milk is also rich in allantoin (which stimulates rapid growth of the new baby) and then the element fades out. This process also takes place in other mammals. Allantoin is a leucocytosis promoter (increases white blood cells) that helps to establish immunity from many infectious conditions….
Yes, scientific investigations from various sources have revealed the presence of pyrrolizidine (PA’s) in comfrey, substances that are regarded as potentially hepatoxic, carcinogenic, and mutagenic. PA’s are believed to have an accumulative effect in the body and may cause hepatic vein blockage and liver toxicity. It is said that the PA’s are only converted to toxic metabolites, in the body, by the liver enzymes. When comfrey is applied externally to the skin, as a cream, it is not considered to be a significant intake of PA’s, in view of low dermal absorption of the PA’s. When comfrey is dried, enzymes are released and much of the alkaloid is destroyed….
From trials, in Minnesota U.S.A. in 1987, in an attempt to determine cultural and environmental factors associated with the production of PA’s, it was found that comfrey, harvested at different times in the growing season, can be of varying PA amounts. Roots were found to have the highest concentration of PA’s, generally with 10 times as much as young leaves. In one trial, in 1986, immature leaves contained 0.026% pyrrolizidine, on a dry weight basis. A subsequent harvest during the growing season, had no detectable PA’s in the leaf (the minimum detectable quantity was 5 ppm). The data indicated, harvest time was a critical factor in producing PA free comfrey, and that mature leaves have an even lower alkaloid content, than young leaves.”
Want to add comfrey into skin care?
But if any of you are aware of Paula Begoun work, she does not like comfrey as an ingredient due to the risk of PA: “Topical application of comfrey has anti-inflammatory properties, but is recommended only for short-term use and only then if you can be sure the amount of pyrrolizidine alkaloids is less than 100 micrograms per application—something that would be impossible to determine without sophisticated testing equipment, making comfrey an ingredient to avoid. The alkaloid content makes it a potential skin irritant (Sources: Chemical Research in Toxicology, November 2001, pages 1546–1551; and Public Health Nutrition, December 2000, pages 501–508).”
This type of information Paula found is not unique. Comfrey's reputation is similiar to other plants too. Just think, any plant extract has a large number of chemicals in them; therefore, you are better the beneficial ones and the very bad ones. Other plant examples are feverfew, chamomile, calendula, arnica montana, etc.
Other than that, here is the DIY recipe provided in the article (you have been warned though):
“Comfrey Cream
To make an ointment to use externally, take 1 cup of finely cut comfrey root and simmer in 1 cup of olive oil until it starts to soften. Cool and strain. Add 50g of beeswax (usually available from supermarkets). Jasmine or orange blossoms may be added to the simmering mixture, to give the cream a pleasant smell. The cream is used to relieve pain and aid healing of cuts, bites, sprains, arthritis, dry vaginal conditions, inflammation and neuralgia.”
The STAR ingredient seems very much to be allantoin. I have seen this ingredient in a lot of skin care products. Below are some research I have found for allantoin use.
In sum, I think people are need to be cognizant of the risk when apply products with comfrey, just really avoid eating the thing. People are better off with looking for products with just allantoin, rather then having it be part of comfrey extract in skin care product.
Have a nice day
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: FINLEY on January 23, 2011, 07:44:25 PM
As a life-long sufferer of acne I have tried everything, and have found the best spot-treatment for acne is Steris Alcare alcohol foam cleanser and Lerosett clay, both which are easily purchased from on-line sources.
The minute I feel the very slightest bump or red area I cleanse it with the Alcare foam- rub the foam gently into the spot for at least 5-15 seconds (it disappears), and then apply Lerosett clay to the spot for 2 hours. I then clean spot again approximately every 1-3 hours with the Alcare foam, as my schedule allows, rubbing the foam into the spot. Then cleanse face at bedtime with regular cleanser, then clean spot with Alcare foam again, and apply Lerosett clay to spot, leaving on overnight. Keep doing this for as many days as it takes for spot to disappear. You will be amazed at how much less traumatic this spot-treatment is compared to many other treatments, and it really works- I usually find that after a few days the small plug that was causing the acne spot will just roll out of the spot when I am rubbing the spot with foam. (You can put a small amt of Lerosett on spot after work if your social life allows.)
The Lerosett clay is organic which I consider a plus. This regimen has worked for me after suffering from acne for 41 years. Good luck!
Title: Advice on treating acne breakouts and blackheads before derma rolling
Post by: kakalakingma on January 23, 2011, 08:53:25 PM
Hi FINELY,
This is so nice, another forum member participate! I have some commentary to share!
I have checked out the STERIS website and I do not see any cleanser, but the closest name I can find is “Alcare ® OR Foamed Antiseptic Handrub”. This is not a cleanser, but technically a hand sanitizer. This company seems to sell their products to professionals. According to the provided MSDS, this hand sanitizer contains the following:
Now, looking that the ingredient list, I am not exactly sure why it is so expensive (it cost about 30 bucks on Amazon). You can get 70% ethyl alcohol or isopropyl alcohol at your local drugstore around a dollar or two. I bought mine at Target for $1.99. FINELY, have you ever tried just applying rubbing alcohol on your pimple spots and compare it with the brand name version?
The research behind alcohol functioning as an effective and broad antiseptic exists and is clear. I tried to do a search for a specific study regarding alcohol and p. acne bacteria to no avail... as of now. But I have provided below several studies testing and discussing about the efficacy of alcohol. I haven't really read the whole study of any of them yet.
Let's just assume 60+ % alcohol solution does kill p. acne bacteria, you must consider the drawbacks from overuse and size of application. Overuse is known to dry out the skin because the alcohol degrease the skin of its natural oil. Plus, it can cause redness and stinging to some people. If you are going to use alcohol, I say it is best to only spot treat just like how you do it, FINELY, and you can do it economically, too. Now, if any of you know who Paula Begoun is, she has not-so-nice things to say about low molecular weight alcohols. According to the ingredient dictionary page on her website, Ms. Begoun states:
"A group of organic compounds that have a vast range of forms and uses in cosmetics. In some benign forms they are glycols used as humectants that help deliver ingredients into skin. When fats and oils are chemically reduced, they become a group of less-dense alcohols called fatty alcohols that can have emollient properties or can become detergent cleansing agents. When alcohols have low molecular weights they can be drying and irritating. The alcohols to be concerned about in skin-care products are ethanol, denatured alcohol, ethyl alcohol, methanol, benzyl alcohol, isopropyl, and SD alcohol, which can be extremely drying and irritating to skin, as well as capable of generating free radical damage. (Sources: "Skin Care—From the Inside Out and Outside In," Tufts Daily, April 1, 2002; eMedicine Journal, May 8, 2002, volume 3, number 5, www.emedicine.com; Cutis, February 2001, pages 25–27; Contact Dermatitis, January 1996, pages 12–16; and http://pubs.niaaa.nih.gov/publications/arh27-4/277-284.htm). When these ingredients are at the top of an ingredient list it is problematic for all skin types, when they are at the end of an ingredient list there isn’t enough concentration present to be considered a problem for skin.
Those with oily skin should avoid high amounts of the problematic types of alcohol mentioned above. These types of alcohol show up in numerous products aimed at oily or acne-prone skin. The problem? In addition to alcohol's other detrimental effects, it can stimulate nerve endings in the skin, causing inflammation that encourage excess oil production at the base of the pore (Sources: Archives of Dermatologic Research, July 2008, pages 311–316; Dermatology, January 2003, pages 17–23; and Medical Electron Microscopy, March 2001, pages 29–40)." (LINK)
Okay, now onto the next product. I have checked the Gunilla of Sweden website and they do not provide the full ingredient list for the LEROSETT® 100% Organic Acne Clay. Therefore, I have no idea what is it in to comment on it. The website does say this: "LEROSETT® contains our "proprietary" heat-treated, mineral rich, 100% organic acne clay and distilled water". I have no idea what kind of clay this is, but I want to see some research. There are a variety of mineral "clay" out there such as bentonite, kaolin, silica, etc. I doubt ingredient lists are supposed to be secretive; they're supposed to be for the public. Why buy something if you have no idea what is in it?
FINELY, I am glad that this method has work for you for 41 years. Keep it up. I do believe there is merit behind your acne regimen. Perhaps the alcohol disinfect the bacteria and drys up the oil as the clay absorbs the oils (for longer period), too, which theoretically prevents the bacteria from eating your sebum and producing inflammation. But something to also consider is that this method may work for only certain types of acne breakouts.